Cowen does not know how many have died in care

TAOISEACH BRIAN Cowen said he was unhappy the HSE could not say how many children died in its care in the past decade.

Responding to strong Opposition criticism, Mr Cowen said: “I do not suggest that is something with which I am happy or the Government would be happy.

“That is something one would have hoped would be available immediately, but that is not the case.” Mr Cowen said the validation of numbers was under way and the HSE had indicated they should be ready by the end of next month.

He said the Government would take whatever legislative measures were necessary to ensure the information was made available to the independent review group on child deaths. A figure of 23 had been confirmed by the HSE, said Mr Cowen.

Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny said he was astonished by the Taoiseach’s response as leader of the Government and the political leader of the country. The information, he said, had been promised to his party’s spokesman on children’s rights Alan Shatter in March of last year.

Addressing Mr Cowen, Mr Kenny said: “You are a former minister for health, you supervised the introduction of Children First, the child protection guidelines, in 1999.” Mr Kenny said there was a dysfunctional HSE and powerless Ministers in the health and children’s area.

The Ministers were unable to acquire information about children who may have died in the care of the State.

“It is truly astonishing that the Taoiseach of the country, himself a former minister for health, does not have this information accurately,” he added. “We have a health department and a HSE hiding behind process and reports.”

Labour leader Eamon Gilmore said that while the Taoiseachs figure was 23 deaths, a weekend newspaper report had put the figure at 200. “If it is as high as 200, then it is extremely serious,” he said.

Mr Cowen said he did not know where the figure of 200 had emerged from. People might be extrapolating on the basis of six deaths in the last quarter since January, and reaching a mathematical conclusion for the past 10 years.

“I don’t know, personally, whether that is a fair presumption to make at all or not,” he added.

Mr Gilmore said if any set of parents had acted as negligently as the State would appear to have acted, to the extent that it was not known how many children had died in its care, moves would be made to remove the children from them.

“What is to happen, or what does happen children for whom the State does not provide the care that would be provided by parents?” he asked.

Mr Gilmore said it was a case of negligence and clear dysfunctionality in the HSE, and the tail wagging the dog as far as its relationship with Minister of State for Children Barry Andrews was concerned.

Mr Cowen said there were legal issues involved. “It is not a question of people thumbing their noses,” he said.

The Cabinet, at its meeting earlier, had decided the various issues would be resolved, and whatever was required would be undertaken as a matter of urgency.

He said a Bill would be approved by the Cabinet and brought into the House as soon as was practicable.