Before beginning the soft talk about Sunday's Ulster football final, Val Andrews and Art McRory want to talk hard. Those who have criticised Ulster football this summer have been a little out of line, and both managers choose the right to reply.

Cavan and Tyrone have got this far on merit, and for Andrews and McRory, all this talk of poor games and bad teams is not wholly accurate. The assembled media in Dublin's Bank of Ireland centre sit nervously in their seats.

"I want to take the opportunity to address the criticism, particularly on the television, after our game with Monaghan," says Andrews, who goes into his first Ulster final as Cavan manager. "It was a poor game and we did shoot a lot of wides, and I've no problem with that.

"But I'm disappointed that people would run down our product knowing the influence that the media have on the youth of today and particularly television.

"I don't think we are going anywhere by saying these are poor games. God forbid we should learn from Sky television but you never hear them saying 'this is the most brutal game of soccer that I've ever seen in my life'. I think we should tinge this criticism with logic and a more rational approach."

Criticism or praise is nothing new to McRory, who this year has once again revitalised Tyrone football along with joint manager Eugene McKenna. But he is quick to agree with Andrews, and calls for more constructive criticism rather than just blind criticism.

"Last week we heard Joe Brolly calling Fermanagh rubbish," says Andrews. "Another presenter wanted some cold water to throw around himself to keep him awake. So I would be very disappointed with the presentation that we're getting with these games.

"Nobody minds criticism providing that it's relatively constructive. But words like rubbish may be wrong. For us, of course, if Tyrone win on Sunday then our supporters will call it a good game. If they don't win then it's not a good game. And if they draw then it's not such a bad game."

When individual players become the target of this criticism, then Andrews believes that some people really have lost the plot.

"You see this personal ridicule as well, which is all very well if the players are getting £50,000 a week. But they have to go home to the families and back to work. We have seen instances where players have come in for personal vilification and I don't think that is right. I would have a problem with that.

"Look, whether it's Pat Spillane or Joe Brolly or Colm O'Rourke, they were all fabulous footballers. They do have some excellent comments but I think they could select their words a little more carefully.

"Rubbish is not a nice word to use for an amateur player. If they want to have a positive influence on the youth of today then you have to give them heroes. You don't get heroes by saying everybody out there was really bad. "And it's not just our games. Nearly every second week you hear it, and I'm disappointed that intelligent people would not be a little more positive and promote the game a little better. You do have bad games but we also have an obligation to promote the game and push it forward."

So then, on to Sunday and a game where Tyrone are strong favourites and Cavan are rank outsiders. Fine, agree both managers.

"To be honest we're delighted to be going in as favourites," says McRory. "I think we can handle it. Although being favourite is just some people's perceptions, and particularly media perceptions. What people are inclined to overlook is that Cavan shot something like 17 wides against Down, and shot 16 wides against Monaghan. Whatever day they stop shooting wides, I wouldn't be like to be on the other end of it. "But we have no difficulty keeping our feet on the ground, even though we've beaten two of the big teams. I mean it's still the first Ulster final for a lot of the players and they realise that it is going to be a big day."

For Andrews, seeing Tyrone being called favourites is something he'll gladly accede to: "Tyrone are the form team but it is a final, 15 men against 15, and a once off. Our players will go out and give it an honest effort. We will make the chances and we take 50 per cent of them then we'll end up with 22 or 23 points and that's not a bad total. And we'll make a game of it.

"Ulster football is always very tight, although we met two great Derry teams in the last two years and they gave us two great pastings. And sometimes you can learn more from bitter defeats than good victories. It's up to the lads to motivate themselves and they make a lot of sacrifices, even though they don't get much out of it. But that's another issue."

Already, the feeling is that McRory has the basis for another great Tyrone team. He feels they are stronger than the heights of 1995-1996 and this is probably a stronger panel than any other since he became involved with the county.

"We do have this influx of young players. And there are seven under-21s on the panel. And three more who were under-21 last year. I do believe that Tyrone will sooner or later win an All-Ireland. We have the infrastructure and we have the players coming through. It may not be this year or next year but I think we have the base to be a power in Gaelic football some time soon."

That's one of the reasons he came back to management. "I just like working with good players. Managers don't manage for anyone else except the players."

"But a lot of people have asked me why I came back again but I honestly don't know. It mostly goes back to the players, to work with them and improve them."