To say there is a debate among ministers on Ireland's role in the EU would not only be an exaggeration, says one senior Government source. It would be entirely untrue.

Up to this week just one Government Minister - Ms Mary Harney - has expressed an ideological view on the matter. She has said the mainland European version of society as being a social democratic one, if imposed here, could threaten economic growth and frighten off US investment.

On Monday, Ms Sile de Valera joined her in sounding a cautionary note, warning that EU directives and regulations "can often seriously impinge on our identity, culture and traditions".

She did not favour closer integration within the EU, she went on, stating that our embracing of Europe had led us at times "to forget our close and very important ties with the United States of America".

But despite opposition condemnation of this as British Tory Europhobia, the comments of both Ministers are far from the strident anti-Europeanism of the Conservative Party and the European far right.

Both Ministers expressed their reservations only after strong declarations of support for the EU and for its enlargement, and acknowledgements of the benefits it has brought to Ireland.

Indeed Ms de Valera and Ms Harney yesterday expressed unambiguous support for the enlargement of the EU. Ms de Valera said Ireland must play a full part in shaping EU foreign policy. In addition, Government sources, including those close to Ms de Valera, clarified her remarks, saying that when she said she was opposed to greater EU integration, she meant she was opposed to greater centralisation.

This further modification allows her view to be placed close to the mainstream, as there are many who argue that the EU can integrate more without at the same time ceding more and more power to a centralised Brussels bureaucracy.

Government sources insist she made her comments without the Taoiseach having any notice or knowledge of them.

While Ms de Valera had told Mr Ahern in the past of her concerns about certain EU directives, he had no idea she was going to say anything publicly, sources say. However, Mr Ahern also maintained he was pleased her comments had sparked a debate.

For not only is there no public political debate, there is no private one at ministerial level, according to several Government sources. The overwhelming consensus that the European project is good for Ireland remains.

While the EU is likely to make important decisions before the end of this year on how it governs itself, there is "absolutely no disagreement" on the Government's attitude, says one Cabinet source.

The French EU Presidency hopes to resolve several issues at the summit in December in Nice. They want to decide on whether the right of all EU member-states to nominate an EU commissioner will continue: Ireland's position is to insist it should.

The current Inter-Governmental Conference considering these issues is also discussing whether to drop the national veto on certain matters, and whether to allow for some increase in the strength of the votes of the larger EU member-states. The Republic would consider this if its Commissioner was secured.

They are also examining the idea of "enhanced co-operation", opening the prospect of a core group of states moving ahead of the other EU members in certain areas.

The Republic's position is to be cautious about the prospect of a "two-speed Europe" but Government sources also accept that if the major EU states want this to happen, the Republic will not be able to stop it.

The predominant view among Fianna Fail Ministers, therefore, is one of pragmatic position-taking on the issues based on Ireland's national interest.

In this context, Ms Harney's and Ms de Valera's views stand out: they purport to be based not only on self-interested concerns (the need to protect economic growth and Irish culture from EU interference) but ideological considerations (support for liberal free market economics and the retention of sovereignty). However, neither has disputed the Government approach to the current Inter-Governmental Conference discussions.

Ms Harney's argument for the limiting of further EU integration is part of a broader ideological opposition to substantial state involvement in the economy and society. While she scoffed yesterday that "Ruairi Quinn seems to believe in the superiority of the European model over the Irish model", Mr Quinn criticised the Government and Fine Gael for being "caught in a 1980s ideological time warp . . . who believe that State spending threatens economic growth or that the United States represents a better economic model for Ireland to aspire to than Denmark, for instance."

Fine Gael's spokesman on European Affairs, Mr Bernard Durkan, also challenged the Tanaiste's view, saying that Ireland's attractiveness to US investment was not because of our distance from the European project, but our closeness to it.

Such public arguments over Europe are notable only because of their rarity, and the general political silence on the issues may get Ireland through this present Inter-Govermental Conference.