WE ALL know him, that horny handed son of toil, as he sits on his bar stool badmouthing "that crowd above in Leinster House". Laying his pint glass on the counter he continues: "Don't tell me they're in that game for the good of the country, sure the whole bloody lot of them is on the take. They're just a pack of rogues."

So much for the received wisdom in certain quarters, but is it true? This has been a bad week for the profession of politics, but is it really a gravy train? "No, it's not," says Democratic Left Minister of State Eamon Gilmore, county councillor since 1985 and a TD since 1989. "The vast majority of people right across the political spectrum that I've been involved with over the years are honest people motivated by a sense of wanting to do something for the general public good."

He added: "I have never come across evidence of anybody being on the take, but I suspect that, like every walk of life, there may be a minority who are." He estimates about 1,000 people in the State hold elected office at parliamentary or local level: "One can expect there would be some among that 1,000 who may do something dishonest from time to time, just as in any other profession you will get people who do something wrong.

There had been many rumours about corruption in county council rezoning decisions in the Dublin area: "I've never come across evidence of it, and I think there comes a point where people have to either put up or shut up. If people have evidence that somebody has been on the take they have an obligation to produce that evidence.

A prominent Labour Party politician from the Dublin area felt politics and planning could be an unhealthy intersection: "I have never been happy with the connections between some politicians and developers, particularly in the greater Dublin area."

IN THE pub after meetings you would see certain developers celebrating a "victory" with the councillors who had supported them, or briefing their political friends on the next zoning application. "Some of the decisions are inexplicable on planning grounds."

The vast majority of politicians were not corrupt - but like Caesar's wife, you have to be seen to be above suspicion. Therefore political contributions should be disclosed and political parties publicly funded, along the lines of Brendan Howl in's Electoral Bill, said the Labour politician.

When Fine Gael backbencher Frances Fitzgerald was first elected to the Dail in 1992 she was surprised by "the lack of respect once you become a TD". Before that she had been chair of the National Women's Council (then known as the Council for the Status of Women): "You can be seen to have integrity one day and once you take the name politician there's an assumption that you're not in it for the good of the country but for some other reason."

The beef tribunal and allegations about corruption in planning had done "huge damage to the body politic". But the idea of politics as a gravy train was "almost amusing" given the financial demands on TDs.

According to Fianna Fail TD Ned O'Keeffe: "Politics is not a gravy train, never has been and never should be. I've never measured it in those terms and I don't even really know what you mean by a gravy train."

He has never been offered any bribes, junkets, freebies or perks. "I have no memories of being offered any concessions that would be above and beyond the norm."

He believes Irish politics is "fairly free" of corruption because its practitioners have not been involved in consultancy work to the same degree as their colleagues in other parliaments. He is totally opposed to public funding of political parties, which he sees as a threat to the democratic system. "I abhor the idea and the belief that the general public and the electorate should pay for political parties. Business contributions were acceptable because "good legislation is good for them" and business people would see themselves as "being obliged to help and assist our democratic system".

His Fianna Fail colleague Senator Dick Roche, a UCD lecturer in public administration and former TD for Wicklow, takes a different view: "If we're going to clean the whole thing up and make sure that there is no impropriety, we're going to have to have some mechanism for funding elections in this country - as they have in other states."

IF THE present situation was allowed to continue, only those with very large private incomes or the backing of powerful party organisations could afford to go into politics. "We're going to destroy politics in this country by our collective failure to resolve the issue of funding: there's a degree of cowardice out there."

Looking back on his 12 years as a public representative he said: "I certainly haven't found it to be a gravy train." If you applied the same effort and skill to just about any other activity you would make more money.

He sees the past week as "probably a defining point in Irish politics". He proposes the appointment of a Public Ethics Commissioner with the status of a High Court judge, "empowered to investigate complaints or allegations of breaches of ethical standards and to publish reports on such examinations". He also wants House Ethics Committees in both Dail and Seanad.

Lobbyist Stephen O'Byrnes has a background in politics, with the Progressive Democrats, and before that in journalism. His clients include the Bank of Ireland and his main activity is to arrange meetings and promote dialogue between them and politicians. "There is no mystery in what I am doing or trying to achieve. In my personal experience I do not think there is much corruption. The vast. majority of people in Irish politics are put to the pin of their collar to make a living."

Overall, unless politicians are consummate actors, they genuinely do not believe their trade is a corrupt one. But there is a growing feeling in Leinster House that something must be done to improve the perception of TDs and senators among the general public.

The prospects for Brendan Howlin's legislation look a lot brighter after this week's events.