"LAST year in May I met my Superior General in Germany. I asked him: `Father General, am I a bad Jesuit?' He replied: `You are not at all a bad Jesuit. You are among the best Jesuits in the world'." Bishop Jin of Shanghai was ordained a Jesuit in 1947, just before the communist victory in China. Today he runs the biggest Catholic diocese in China.
The 81 year old churchman related the exchange with his Superior General to make the point that he is a member in good standing of the universal Catholic Church.
But many members of the Roman Catholic Church outside China are, to say the least, ambivalent about the Most Rev Aloysius Jin Lu Xian, despite the fact that he spent 18 years, from 1955 to 1972, in jail for his faith.
Since religion was permitted again in China in the late 1970s after a 30 year break, Bishop Jin has become one of the most prominent leaders of the Patriotic Catholic Church, which gives allegiance not to Rome but Beijing.
Sometimes known as the "official" Catholic Church, it is allowed to open churches, hold services and ordain priests in return for loyalty to the state rather than a foreign pope. Bishop Jin offers prayers for Pope John Paul at Mass but only as a "more equal" bishop, not someone with authority over him.
Did this mean he was like an Anglican bishop, I asked. "Oh no," he said. "We are Catholics not Anglicans. Roman Catholics."
Priests and bishops of the "unofficial" Catholic Church who accept the Pope's authority operate mostly underground, and are regularly persecuted: as many as 40 may be in prison for trying to organise a pro Rome movement.
"We live on the mainland, not in Hong Kong or Ireland," explained the bespectacled prelate, who was made Bishop of Shanghai in 1988, taking the place of an "unofficial" cardinal who was released from prison. "But the Pope doesn't know the real situation in China."
A slight, dignified figure in fawn pullover and wearing a broad gold cross, Bishop Jin said he found the work difficult at his age. Recently 70,000 pilgrims had come to the Basilica and he had to organise 30,000 confessions. He sighed. "The young think they have never committed a sin but older people think they are great sinners.
The shortage of priests is a legacy of the first 30 years of communist rule, especially the 1966-1976 Cultural Revolution when all religious activity was banned. The Basilica of St Mary was wrecked.
Many Catholic figures outside China keep in touch with Bishop Jin, especially those princes of the church who were his classmates at St Ignatius's College in Rome. He is allowed to travel abroad, and visited Maynooth briefly last year.
Though Bishop Jin is clearly not one of them, a small number of clerics of the Patriotic Church are said by Catholic Church sources to be secretly "reconciled" with Rome. The Vatican is clearly anxious to avoid any hint of schism.
Shanghai's Jesuit bishop insists his differences with the Church in Rome are not in matters of faith but of politics. "We want complete normalisation," he said. "It is not us who are putting obstacles in the way. The difficulties come from the Holy See. It recognises Taiwan as China for example. This is an obstacle. Our government is in Beijing."
What of the future for the Catholic Church when Hong Kong, whose three bishops give their full allegiance to the Vatican, is reunited with China this year? "There will be no subordination at all, only co operation" with the territory's 300,000 Catholics, he said, pointing out China's plans to have one country with two systems. But "I am sure the co operation will be more close.
Does he ever intercede for unofficial priests in prison? "I ask the government never to arrest them," replied Bishop Jin, who estimated the number of unofficial Catholics in China at three to four million, though 95 per cent of believers in Shanghai were loyal to him. Despite the presence at the interview of two Chinese government officials, he added: "I have some relations with unofficial bishops who come to ask me for advice," and that he planned a secret meeting with an unofficial bishop in April.
As for his own prison life, "I forget and forgive," he said. "When you reach my age, 18 years is not such a long time."
Lack of sufficient funds to run the diocese is a constant worry. He told his Superior General in Germany when they met last year of his financial difficulties, and received recognition of a tangible kind. "I asked his help and he gave me a cheque for $100,000," Bishop Jin said happily, "and he told me: `You can say that to other Jesuits, that I gave it to you'."