BARR TRIBUNAL: The chief Garda negotiator at the siege in Abbeylara has denied a claim by a witness that he said it was "negotiating practice" to use cigarettes as a bargaining tool.
John Carthy's cousin, Mr Tom Walsh, told the Barr tribunal that Det Insp Michael Jackson said it would be negotiating practice to seek a few cartridges from Mr Carthy in return for agreeing to his request for cigarettes.
Yesterday, Det Insp Jackson said he had never discussed the issue of cigarettes with Mr Walsh.
"I wouldn't discuss things of that nature with an intermediary," he said. The tribunal is investigating the events around the fatal shooting of Mr Carthy after a 26-hour siege at his home on April 20th, 2000.
On that morning, Mr Walsh, who was described as Mr Carthy's best friend, had been brought down to the negotiating point in an attempt to encourage him to leave the house. However, Mr Carthy pointed the gun at him and Mr Walsh retreated.
Mr Justice Barr asked the detective if he had considered using Mr Walsh as a "vehicle" to get the cigarettes to Mr Carthy. Det Insp Jackson said the issue had not arisen as Mr Walsh had failed to "engage" with Mr Carthy. Mr Carthy had requested 20 Major on a few occasions during the siege but they were not delivered.
On Thursday morning, three packets of Benson and Hedges were brought to the negotiating point. Det Insp Jackson said his colleague had been informed that it was this brand and not Major, that Mr Carthy smoked.
However, counsel for the tribunal, Mr Raymond Comyn SC, showed the tribunal a photograph of the interior of the Carthy home. A discarded pack of Major cigarettes lay on top of a bag of rubbish.
The tribunal heard that a major development was made when Mr Carthy told the Garda negotiator that he was afraid he would have to go back to a psychiatric hospital.
Det Insp Jackson appealed to him to leave the house and Mr Carthy seemed to consider the option. But he then grew aggressive, saying, "no, you won't break me, no way".
At about 1. 15 p.m. that day, the detective learned that Mr Carthy had called his friend, Mr Kevin Ireland, at about 11.30 a.m. and had told him he was going to do "something big". Det Insp Jackson said the phone call was "somewhat perplexing" and did not tally "with what we were seeing on the ground".
In the phone conversation, Mr Carthy seemed to be very rational and knew exactly what he was doing. He boasted that he had forced gardaí to duck to avoid his gun.
Asked if it would have been "prudent" if the Garda team had withdrawn completely from the scene at any point, Det Insp Jackson said gardaí feared Mr Carthy would harm himself or become involved in a confrontation on leaving the house.
