Interview/Anthony Foley: The Munster captain tells Gerry Thornley about being axed by Ireland - and touches on a certain upcoming cup tie

Anthony Foley strides from the car park across the road to Claw's, aka the Sinbin. Dressed in his official Munster tracksuit, he's hardly anonymous, but draws few enough glances, even from the young girl in the lift who is wearing a replica shirt. Hereabouts Munster is just an everyday part of the fabric of life, although the bunting on O'Connell Street hints at a rather big game on the horizon.

Inside, Claw, the great proprietor himself, is on hand. Peter Clohessy directs us to a back room and has the coffees sent in. Plenty of memorabilia and memories here.

Foley immediately walks over to one of the pictures on the wall and declares with a chuckle, "Ah, the try that never was." He studies it for a while, notes where the touchjudge Steve Lander was situated - he had the best view in the house yet ruled out John O'Neill's perfect touchdown in that 2001 Heineken European Cup semi-final in Lille - and walks off with deliberate understatement: "Never mind."

It might be stretching things to describe it as a mini-crisis in Foley's career. He's been in worse pickles. But at 32, out of contract at the end of next season, he was omitted from the Irish squad last autumn and again during the Six Nations.

Four years on the treadmill for Ireland and Munster had suited him mentally and physically. But these last few months, like much of the season, have been regularly interrupted and without flow. No less than Munster themselves, their skipper is one who benefits from being match-hardened. He was hardened in the Munster school of playing week in, week out and is the better for it.

Hearing Eddie O'Sullivan tell him last November he was no longer an integral part of Ireland's plans hurt.

"He said he needed to get a new option at number eight for the next World Cup. He didn't see me as being around at the next World Cup and he needed to look around at other options.

"That's his prerogative, to be honest, and he's entitled to do that. In fairness, Denis (Leamy) was probably one of the few people who came well out of the autumn with a bit of credit, and he had a great Six Nations."

Foley says he doesn't hurt as much because at least he was replaced by "one of our own", one he has seen coming through the ranks. "I saw him play for Rockwell against Munchin's in Thomond Park and he was a standout player that day as well. He's just got great ability. Being selfish you'd prefer it to be yourself, but if it's not going to be you you'd prefer it to be one of the lads."

Hence, he's been in the unusual position of watching from the outside, keenly aware injuries were his likeliest route back into the Irish team but at the same time not wanting to wish them on one-time team-mates. He watched most of the matches at his home in Killaloe, a fitting retreat from the madding crowds.

"You're trying to stay away from the clubs and pubs, and you have one eye on the fact that you still have a quarter-final of the European Cup to play. So you try not to get involved in the whole party atmosphere that's around the Six Nations."

He winced at the Italian game, as physically tough, from his perspective, as any he ever played in but with the Azzurri also having more of a cutting edge. He cringed at the first-half error count in Paris, but found the last half-hour "uplifting". He saw the home wins against Wales and Scotland as reinforcing Lansdowne Road's fortress reputation and genuinely enjoyed the feast of rugby on the last day of the Six Nations.

"It was compelling viewing and to see Shane Horgan score in the corner - let's hope it will be the last time we see that this season," he adds with a laugh - "was brilliant. The way they went after it and got the scores they needed."

He doesn't appear to have beaten himself over the head about it. "You'd love to be there but you know it's not going to be, so you just get on with it. You just hope that you get back in there eventually. You can really get down in yourself if you keep wishing you were there. So you just learn from the past, move on and try and get the best out of a bad situation for yourself."

Home in Killaloe has been enhanced by the arrival in May last year of little Tony, or Anthony Edward - Anthony and Olive's first child.

"It gives you a different perspective on everything you're doing, and a different reason for doing stuff. It's not all about yourself anymore. There's a little fella to look after as well. It's probably more important than sport, to be honest."

Not that we should think of him going all soft, or losing his ambition or self-belief. You ask him if he's given up on wearing the green again.

"I haven't and I don't think I will. You don't know what's going to happen down the road, so it's a matter of trying to get yourself into a position that you can get back in there, and if you can get back in there justify it. That's the main thing. Get yourself into the best possible shape or position, so that if an opportunity comes you can get full grasp of it."

All that said and done, he can read the tea leaves.

"It's very hard to change a man's mind, especially when the team is successful as it is. You're nearly waiting for an injury to get back in there. I know from past experience that he doesn't change his side at a whim. So unless somebody is doing something terribly wrong you're not going to get a sniff of being back in there."

At 32, he still feels that a player learns all the time and gets better as he gets older. He sees things more readily, and with a more balanced perspective the pressures aren't as intense, although the stomach would still be churning before the likes of the game against Perpignan.

It might have helped his mood and undoubtedly his game were he playing more regularly. With Ireland A redefined as more of a developmental squad, five out of seven weekends were spent with a watching brief: "You lose your match sharpness and it becomes increasingly difficult to get selected."

He was happy with his form coming into the Six Nations, and played probably his best back-to-back games of the season against Castres and Sale in January. Other games that were afforded him and Munster didn't enhance his or their cause. A scrappy home win over the Dragons was followed by a defeat at home to Glasgow, a poor day out for all of them. They then "fought like cats and dogs" with an understrength side in Ulster, before losing to the Dragons away last week.

But the most disappointing moment or aspect in all of those games was the sight of Barry Murphy's leg break in Ravenhill.

"You knew it was serious because you don't see a lad react like that. Like, Trevor Halstead stopped doing what he was doing and turned back to Barry. It's a scary thing. A guy's career is on the up and up and suddenly in a shot it's gone. It keeps everything on the straight and narrow. Other fellas can't really complain."

Foley speaks of the contrast Murphy offered to Halstead's aggressive, straight running: "It took two to mark him. We call him Bambi, because he's like a new little deer; his legs are everywhere and the way he runs you can't really see where he's going. And he's a lovely lad as well."

That searing break Murphy made in Castres, that devastating solo try against Sale, to see "one of our own" do that gave a great lift to everyone in the Munster squad.

He's missed all right, though Foley maintains it's an opportunity for somebody else, and after the Six Nations hiatus, the postponement of the Llanelli game, Foley maintains, contributed to the lack of fluidity against Perpignan.

Whatever the general perception, particularly in the aftermath of Leinster's outstanding win in Toulouse, the Munster captain still draws much encouragement from the way "we rolled our sleeves up" against Perpignan, a heavyweight, in-form team who do not concede many points.

"We went in at half-time and we had a bit of a bite about us. We knew we had a job to do and we got nine points clear. We ground out a good win. I've grown up watching Munster Cup rugby and teams have been hammered 6-3. At times in cup competitions that's what you need to do. Performances don't matter in cup competitions."

Spoken like a true disciple, and by a natural-born winner who represents Munster's heartbeat as much as ever. For once though, Munster were upstaged by Leinster, but Foley is genuinely lavish in his admiration for what Leinster did in Toulouse, placing it as an achievement beyond Munster's win in Bordeaux over the same opponents in 2000.

"We only saw the first 30 minutes of it so we didn't really see it until the following day. They scored some lovely tries. It's kinda hard to talk about it that way but I thought they played very well and you have to say well done."

Next Sunday will be his 75th European Cup match: remarkable testimony to his durability and consistency, and unequalled in the competition's 10-year history. He's only missed one European match, away to Harlequins eight seasons ago.

"Deccie (Kidney) dropped me for one game," he recalls mischievously. "He said 'rested'. I said I was okay but he said 'rested'. Myself and Wally (David Wallace) were being 'rested' for the weekend. 'But it's a Heineken Cup game?'"

He enjoys some of the terminology doing the rounds in the context of Sunday week. Civil War. Two tribes going to war. And it's also team-mates and friends pitted against each other.

"It's probably the first time two Irish sides have met in the Heineken Cup. I've often wondered how English or French sides go about it, because of the familiarity. But at the end of the day there is a big prize at stake and both sides will be going hammer and tongs at it. I tell you if it was brother against brother it wouldn't matter, never mind friends against friends," he says, laughing again. "I think both sides would cut off their right arm to get to Cardiff. And we want to win that tournament."

Ditto the supporters. The Red Army would dread losing to Leinster. Foley and his team-mates are conscious many of them also live and work in Dublin. In his Killaloe hideaway, he's removed from the hype a little and leaves the ticket arrangements to his father Brendan. He can't imagine what the week of the game will be like.

No less than with the supporters for now, though we've broken the rules a tad, he'd prefer to talk about the Edinburgh game tonight. A massive game, he calls it.

"We've lost our last three Celtic League games, so it becomes very important that we get a win and get back on track. We were in a great position until the Glasgow game. We need to get the atmosphere back in Thomond Park. We need an absolutely intimidating environment for Edinburgh.

"You're talking about more than half the Scottish team coming over and they play a brand of rugby that if they're let get into the flow of their game, can cause you all sorts of bother. You can be running all day after shadows. So it's just as important a game for us as a team to get back on the road in this competition and help us build for the following week."

Well, he was the one who brought that up. It just won't go away.